<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">The other factor is that of ageing audiences.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">I'm in transit, and away from numbers (assuming I have any), but isn't there data that young people in Japan have lost interest in Hollywood cinema. (I think it's telling that the highest grossing foreign film in the first half of the year was LES MISERABLES.)</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">This is worrying for exhibitors and distributors because if local audiences lose interest in Japanese cinema, then they may not switch to watching non-Japanese cinema. And the interest in Hollywood cinema hasn't been maintained by illegal downloads/discs as in China.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">The audience for other Asian cinemas within Japan is also ageing. Despite the quality of some of the Asian festival programming in Japan in the past decade, new directors and stars haven't become marketable. And the 40-something Asian film fans are quite conservative.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">Purely anecdotally, when a ticket is ¥1800, surely that limits the range of films people are willing to pay for. When I was living in London, and paying a similar amount, I didn't think I was getting value for money when watching drama. I wanted spectacle or a "sure thing".</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">At the moment, that ¥1800 is going to films that audiences are confident will give them that "sure thing", because they're based on manga/novels/television series and/or are heavily marketed at them. I'd like to think viewing habits would change at ¥1000.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">From talking to a handful of distributors over the years, they're also concerned by the ¥1800 prices and say that the exhibitors are the problem. And of course, exhibitors don't much care what films are filling their cinemas, as long as there are bums on seats.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">I'm not sure that the lateness is a factor. China is also slow at getting films, but they often make huge box office. People do explain commercial flops on the late release in China, but that's usually an excuse to justify poor performance of a film that would never have worked.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">And in China, those late films ARE available on DVD for US$1. Cinema tickets in China are expensive, and again people want that "sure thing", so having friends recommend films that they've already seen on DVD can help the theatrical box office rather than hinder it.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">South Korea did have a problem with illegal downloads, but from talking to buyers that is far less of a concern now. The American Film Market was full of South Koreans buying IPTV rights because there's real money there now. When it's cheap, why not just pay for it.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">Fundamentally, the problem may be that Japan doesn't give consumers many options and gouges cinephiles. It would rather have a cinema 80% empty than have it 80% full if revenue was equal, because then your maximising the money you squeezing from each customer.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">Anecdotally again, but didn't the Korean Wave partly come about because Japanese drama series sellers wouldn't lower their prices, opening up a space for the South Koreans. And wasn't it actor agencies who had boxed sets withdrawn from HK stores for being priced too low.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">I also feel that Japanese cinema is in crisis. At the American Film Market, the JETRO/UniJapan section was like a graveyard. One major seller said that she also had little business when she had a proper exhibiting space the previous year, so it's not just about location.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">It's not just that Japanese have lost interest in foreign cinema, but foreigners have lost interest in Japanese cinema. And those two things are connected. If you don't know what foreign viewers want, how do you make films that appeal to them also.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_sign_1384765983050183936"><div>Stephen Cremin</div></div> <br><p style="color:#A0A0A8;">On 18 November 2013 at 17:04:46, Mark Roberts (<a href="mailto://mroberts37@mail-central.com">mroberts37@mail-central.com</a>) wrote:</p> <blockquote type="cite" class="clean_bq"><span><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div>
<title></title>
<div>Hi Kim,</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Better data is called for, but based upon personal
observation, the dividing line between cinéphiles and the general
public seems much sharper in Japan. In my experience, if I tell an
acquaintance that I see several films a month in a theater, they
might easily say: "oh... so you are an eiga otaku." According to
UNESCO, the national average for Japan has been to view around 1.5
films per year in a theater (compare ~3.5/year for S. Korea and 5+
for the U.S.). So, even going once a month can already set you
apart.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>I would agree with Alex and Eija that the demand for films to
open sooner can also be tied to Internet access. Regarding relative
rates of piracy, the numbers I've seen are from the BSA, and so
they apply to computer software. That's not exactly the same as for
films, but is likely a reasonable indicator. According to the BSA
stats, the global rate in 2012 was around 42%, with 60% in the Asia
Pacific region. In East Asia, the numbers are 77% for China, 43%
for H.K., 40% for S. Korea, and 21% for Japan. As Alex indicated,
Japan has the lowest rate in all of Asia. </div>
<div><br></div>
<div>W.r.t. cinéphiles wanting to see films on the big screen, I
would say your point about the numbers being small is the most
significant. Yes, there are committed cinéphiles who insist on
going to theaters, but are they numerous enough to keep the current
ecosystem going? I don't see it. Since theater spectatorship in
Japan is in decline compared to a number of other countries, there
is at present a "cinema bubble". I.e., there are now probably too
many theaters for the current patterns of consumption. As Jasper
mentions in his review for Screen, the number of screens shrank
between 2011 and 2012. The number was small, but 82% of the screens
that closed were non-multiplex theaters. That translates directly
into a loss of diversity (what cinéphiles are looking for), and has
an impact on forms of spectatorship.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Following current trends — and given that Abenomics will
almost certainly fail to increase wages, ergo provide more
disposable income for people to see films — we should expect
ongoing contraction in the exhibition market. </div>
<div><br></div>
<div>One question here is how streaming services will offset the
shrinking number of screens. Will VOD in part make up for the loss
and/or deliver a more diverse ecosystem? That's supposed to be the
promise of the Internet, but I wonder if its going to play out that
way. In theory, VOD could give us access to lots of films that are
now mouldering in vaults, but who's going to pay to digitize them?
How will the rights issues be sorted? I think there is cause for
concern because of how digital distribution has unfolded for the
music industry. Instead of a rich landscape of independents,
distribution is dominated by a small number of mega media
companies. Their business model has stabilized, and as David
Lowery nicely summarizes it: "Old Boss: pays the artist too
little. New Boss: pays the artist nothing."</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Again, I would like to see more detailed data than what Eiren
is serving up...</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>M.</div>
<div><br></div>
<br>
<div>
<div>On Nov 18, 2013, at 3:29 PM, Kim Icreverzi wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">I share Mark's first question and
would be very interested to hear the response.<br>
<br>
To Mark's last point(s) about cinema not being important in Japan
(and I have a sneaking suspicion we've had a conversation along
these lines in person at some point, Mark), I guess I'd like to
push back against the quantitative argument and ask more about
forms of cinephilia in Japan. My sense is that Mark's right
when he says that it doesn't seem like the "general public" is
picking up and seeing foreign films online instead and, as a
result, you don't have this same demand for speed that Alex is
talking about in the case of South Korea (is there also something
here with respect to copyright enforcement or concerns about
piracy?). Anecdotally, I know a number of cinephiles in Japan
who insist on seeing things only in theaters and who, though they
might like to see films sooner, also are prepared to wait to see
them on the big screen. Which is to say, that cinema for
many of the cinephiles I know remains tied to the space of the
theater. And while those numbers might not be very large (ie
those who persist in seeing movies in the theater, still often
seeing double or triple bills) this sort of spectatorship is alive
in a way that I feel like I see much more rarely in the US, where
that sort of commitment to viewing conditions seems increasingly
(framed) like a relic of the past.<br>
<br>
Perhaps the other question that this might raise of foreign films,
which relates again to Mark's question, is whether "foreign films"
are going largely the way of the cinephile? [Also we should
consider the way that cinema gets folded into the call to
participate in domestic/national/nationalist forms of consumption
in the wake of the disasters]<br>
Kim <br>
<br>
On 11/17/13 7:40 PM, Alex Zahlten wrote:<br></div>
<blockquote cite="mid:trinity-ba8396f4-1ded-4f38-a4bd-30e7097e6776-1384746057246@3capp-gmx-bs38" type="cite">
<div style="font-family: Verdana;font-size: 12.0px;">
<div>
<div>Good points, Mark. To the clogged distribution pipeline I
would add another reason for the time lag for theatrical releases
in Japan: Because they can. Japan has been probably the most
successful country in the world in keeping online piracy (fairly)
under control. This means there is much less pressure for a
day-and-date release that is synchronized with the rest of the
world. Compare this with South Korea, where US films have to come
out very soon after the US release date simply because if they
don't everyone will already have seen the film online / downloaded
it. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>Best,</div>
<div>Alex</div>
<div>
<div name="quote" style="margin:10px 5px 5px 10px; padding: 10px 0 10px 10px; border-left:2px solid #C3D9E5; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">
<div style="margin:0 0 10px 0;"><b>Gesendet:</b> Sonntag, 17.
November 2013 um 21:19 Uhr<br>
<b>Von:</b> "Mark Roberts" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:mroberts37@mail-central.com"><mroberts37@mail-central.com></a><br>
<b>An:</b> "Japanese Cinema Discussion Forum" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:kinejapan@lists.service.ohio-state.edu"><kinejapan@lists.service.ohio-state.edu></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [KineJapan] The marketshare of Japanese
films in Japan</div>
<div name="quoted-content">
<div>So, a follow-up question would be: since Eiren is padding the
numbers, which sources give a better breakdown of <i>jishu
eiga</i>, <i>pinku</i>, anime, ODS, etc.? The Japanese Film
Database has some of this information, but not all.
<div> </div>
<div>As for foreign films coming to Japan late, I have seen this
again and again. For international distribution, Japan is very
often dead last in the entire world. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>My hypothesis is that there are at least two things going on
here. </div>
<div> </div>
<div>First, I suspect that foreign films "arrive" late in Japan
because the major distribution companies are giving priority to
their stuff, and there are not enough independent companies to pick
up the slack. I have heard people in distribution companies say
that a major foreign film was bought at Cannes, almost two years
before it opened in Tokyo. The second factor is simply that
the general public are not very engaged in new films. I don't
have the impression that large numbers of people are accessing
films via the Internet. That kind of culture seems more marginal
here. Rather, people are just not watching them at all.
Frequentation statistics in theaters would seem to bear this
out.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Simply put, compared to the US, the UK, France, South Korea
and Hong Kong, cinema just isn't very important in Japan
today.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>M.</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 18, 2013, at 10:05 AM, Gregory Johnson wrote:</div>
<blockquote>
<div>This is just a guess for which I have no proof, but I wonder
if the extent to which Japanese are watching foreign films without
going through the box office is rising. It takes a while for
foreign films to get to theaters in Japan. Many times I've already
seen something on an international flight before it appears here.
And despite various barriers, people often can access them on the
internet before they officially arrive. Are there any grounds for
this idea?<br>
<br>
Greg Johnson<br>
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