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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Hi all,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Thanks again for all these advices.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">I understand better all the steps of the process I have to follow to
make it right … <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Do you have any idea of how long the process (successive baths) takes
for a specimen like a fish (salmon for example) ? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">But, with the last message of Robert Waller, I don’t know what I should
do any more … Is it best to follow the ladder, or to transfer directly the specimens into Kaiserling, maybe with just a bath of water or ethanol to make the specimen release the formol, just for 1 day ?
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">And actually, I’ve never done
</span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">measurements of osmotic pressure … So it scares me a little to do it 3 times for each
specimen. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">The collection is not really used nor studied scientifically for the
moment. We don’t think it will be more studied in the future, but its reconditioning will have to allow scientific studies, even if we don’t know in which purposes yet. Actually, t</span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">he
principal goal is to make the collection safer for its move and storage. </span>
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">In fact, if I’m understanding all that you said right, you advise us
to change our mind and use other solutions which will be easier to put in place and will be less at risk for the specimens … Am I right ?
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Thanks again !<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Best wishes.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">Juliette Galpin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#17375E;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><b><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">De :</span></b><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
rw@protectheritage.com [mailto:rw@protectheritage.com] <br>
<b>Envoyé :</b> dimanche 20 août 2017 19:26<br>
<b>À :</b> Galpin Juliette; 'John E Simmons'; 'Dirk Neumann'<br>
<b>Cc :</b> nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu; Baglione Gabrielle; Cremiere Cédric<br>
<b>Objet :</b> RE: [Nhcoll-l] Information about fluid collections<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Much of this discussion is beyond my area of expertise but I do want to point out some apparent misunderstandings about osmotic pressure.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Osmotic pressure is a product of water activity and is independent of what substances are causing the reduction in water activity, that is, whether ethanol,
glycerol, potassium acetate or whatever. It would seem unwise to step through dilutions of ethanol then progressions of concentration to another preservative solely for the purposes of reducing osmotic pressure differences. The least osmotic pressure difference
may be through direct transfer or some other path. I do want to recognize that there may be other reasons for wanting to go through a stepped procedure but we should not think that is the only, or the best, way to complete a transfer while avoiding osmotic
pressure differences. Measurements of osmotic pressure differences between initial, final, and intermediate solutions will be required. For ethanol water solutions the data available in: Waller and Strang, Physical-chemical properties of preservative solutions
I: Ethanol-water solutions. Collection Forum 12(2), 70-85, 1996.. I suspect for Kaiserling solution new measurements will be required. These can be easily made through freezing point depression measurements – an experiment many of us may have conducted in
grade school.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Finally, I hope options other than Kaiserling solution will be identified and evaluated before a course of action is decided upon. Most notably, what are the
current and anticipated uses of the collection, and how will collection utility for those purposes be affected by whatever preservative solution is chosen, from among several options considered.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Rob<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Robert Waller, PhD, CAPC, FIIC<br>
President and Senior Risk Analyst<br>
Protect Heritage Corp.<br>
622 Simoneau Way<br>
Ottawa ON K4A 1P4<br>
email: </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><a href="mailto:rw@protectheritage.com"><span lang="EN-CA" style="color:#0563C1">rw@protectheritage.com</span></a><br>
</span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">internet:
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.protectheritage.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=qMxSZlxGcerJgj9ik1K_TyC-LYbMTDFyftXW88giogU&e="><span lang="EN-CA" style="color:#0563C1">www.protectheritage.com</span></a><br>
</span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">phone: 613-883-2707 (Canada)<br>
phone: 303-872-9739 (USA)<br>
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><img border="0" width="16" height="16" id="Image_x0020_12" src="cid:image001.gif@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="ORCID iD"></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#494A4C;background:white"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__orcid.org_0000-2D0002-2D9500-2D4113&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=idOmFLDQWGDzil2OALvQWb39HNXdadAcb_uhWL-gK1o&e="><span style="color:#0563C1">http://orcid.org/0000-0002-9500-4113</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">skype: rrwaller<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">and,
</span></i><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Research Associate, Canadian Museum of Nature<br>
<i>and,</i> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Queen’s University<br>
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><img border="0" width="83" height="27" id="Image_x0020_11" src="cid:image002.png@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="cid:image003.png@01D16EDD.07D59280"></span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><img border="0" width="95" height="29" id="Image_x0020_10" src="cid:image003.jpg@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="http://nature.ca/images/logo_e.jpg"></span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><img border="0" width="41" height="29" id="Image_x0020_9" src="cid:image004.png@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="Description: http://www.queensu.ca/writingcentre/images/QueensLogo.png"></span><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><br>
</span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.facebook.com_ProtectHeritageCorp-3Fref-3Dtn-5Ftnmn&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=yA49ucZoKb8pcdNbfcwigIE0QBRZQiWbnxIu06nJpjw&e="><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="87" height="24" id="Image_x0020_8" src="cid:image005.png@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="cid:image006.png@01D16EDD.07D59280"></span></a><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"> </span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_-23-21_ProtectHeritage&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=P806XbtDL-H_2eG-jAp7Afw7yL-HfUGJhfILxz-YLxY&e="><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:windowtext;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="66" height="24" id="Image_x0020_7" src="cid:image006.png@01D31A8A.20F91480" alt="cid:image007.png@01D16EDD.07D59280"></span></a><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">De :</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Simon Moore [mailto:couteaufin@btinternet.com]
<br>
<b>Envoyé :</b> vendredi 18 août 2017 11:59<br>
<b>À :</b> Galpin Juliette<br>
<b>Cc :</b> nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu<br>
<b>Objet :</b> Re: [Nhcoll-l] Information about fluid collections<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Juliette,<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Firstly, it is wise to make up the Kaiserling III preservative well in advance before use, this will help to avoid some of the air bubble issues. Make sure that the glycerine is thoroughly mixed in, there should be no Schleren optic effects!
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Ideally to move specimens from alcohol to K III does involve a large osmotic pressure change and I am always advising against it. I have never preserved medusae or other jelly forms in it, however some jewel anemones (Corynactis viridis)
survived well but these were collected fresh, narcotised and taken through the Kaiserling process!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I would suggest, that if this process really must go ahead that you try a few experimental runs first. It will take up much of your time, bearing in mind that you will have to take each specimen down a hydration ladder to water and then
into a KIII solution with only half the glycerine content so that the specimens can accommodate to this stage - they will float at first and then gradually sink, then they can be transferred to the next stage - this will happened all the way down the ladder
of alcohols - 60%, 40%, 20%, 10%, water, half-strength KIII then normal KIII. You will need a small tank for each stage - the clip-top plastic ‘really useful’ boxes are good for this and you will need one of those kitchen serving/straining ladles with holes
in it to transfer the specimens gently through each stage!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify">I have had no experience of preserving DNA in KIII, I have always used 96% ethanol. For the formula I have always used: <span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">Kaiserling III (preservative):
Potassium acetate (200g), glycerol (300), distilled water (900). There are many later variations and modifications </span><span style="font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">including</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif""> Lunquist</span><span style="font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">’</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">s.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Thymol is a useful additive to prevent fungal growth and the camphor is good although I have never tried this modification before. Normally the pot. acetate will be enough to prevent germination of fungal spores but it’s always best to
take precautions, especially with so many specimens.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Feel free to come back to me and the List if you have any issues, further questions.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">With all good wishes, Simon.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Simon Moore MIScT, RSci, FLS, ACR<br>
Conservator of Natural Sciences and Cutlery Historian,<br>
<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.natural-2Dhistory-2Dconservation.com&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=sGqkFdBBNp5V7RbtxrN-uOGT4gw227xC1IVhu8s2Kv0&e=">www.natural-history-conservation.com</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On 18 Aug 2017, at 08:50, Galpin Juliette <<a href="mailto:juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr">juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Hi Everybody,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Thank you all for answering me so quickly !</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Actually, the collection needs to be moved into safer fluids, for its own conservation (the fluids are evaporating), and because it will be moved
to a new storage, that need to match new standards (no flammable or toxic products allowed, no evaporation of products, keeping the possibility of studying DNA, etc.). It is compulsory from our guardianship and funders of our new storage location. And Kaiserling
seemed like a good idea, because it matches all these constraints. But I completely understand all the reservations you have regarding this operation and the harm it could do to specimens. That is why I need all the help possible to do this operation, keeping
the risks to a minimum.<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Simon, you assumed well, we have many marine organisms like fishes, shellfishes, cnidarians, sponges, ascidians, and so on... But we also have
mammals, reptilians and amphibians for instance. Will Kaiserling be fine for these specimens too ? Do they need more precautions ?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">How could I do to avoid having these bubbles due to changing in osmotic pressure ? I don’t know how to measure this osmotic pressure and watch
out for its changeover… And we don’t know in which fluid the collections are currently preserved, neither the way they were fixed.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Could you help me set the better process to do this changeover with all precautions needed please ? For a changeover into ethanol, I’ve seen that
the specimens must have been adapted to their new fluid by successive baths of ethanol at different concentrations. Do I have to follow the same process with Kaiserling ?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I will only use the preservative fluid, because all the specimens have already been fixed (I guess).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">For the formula of the preservative solution, I’ve found that it is 900g Potassium acetate ; 6L Water ; 3,6L glycerol ; and some thymol. What are
the good proportions for the mixture then ?! Thank for the recipe and the way to do it, but is it the same with thymol than with camphor ?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Again, thank you very much to all of you for helping me to implement this delicate operation.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Kind regards.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Juliette Galpin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Juliette,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">You have asked a very interesting question. I agree with the responses from my colleagues concerning the caution about osmotic pressure and the kinds
of specimens involved. Could you please tell us (1) what kinds of specimens are in the collection (marine invertebrates or vertebrates, fresh water or terrestrial invertebrates or vertebrates?) and (2) the reason why you are considering changing the preserving
to Kaiserling? Kaiserling has been mostly used for anatomical specimens in an attempt to preserve the color of the tissues, and as far as I know it has not been used on a very wide variety of natural history specimens.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Sincerely,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">John</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">John E. Simmons<br>
Museologica<br>
128 E. Burnside Street<br>
Bellefonte, Pennsylvania 16823-2010<br>
</span><a href="mailto:simmons.johne@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">simmons.johne@gmail.com</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><br>
303-681-5708<br>
</span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.museologica.com_&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=MaVgA9xqNCcYwOGYnSa5MjTnwXizZKHjR0iyRtqJ0j0&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">www.museologica.com</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><br>
and<br>
Adjunct Curator of Collections<br>
Earth and Mineral Science Museum & Art Gallery<br>
Penn State University<br>
University Park, Pennsylvania<br>
and<br>
Instructor, Museum Studies<br>
School of Library and Information Science<br>
Kent State University</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">On Wed, Aug 16, 2017 at 9:09 AM, Dirk Neumann <</span><a href="mailto:dirk.neumann@zsm.mwn.de" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">dirk.neumann@zsm.mwn.de</span></a><span lang="EN-US">> wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Dear Simon,<br>
dear Galpin,<br>
<br>
the baseline for changing the holding fluid is: Do not change, unless there is a good reason to do so.<br>
<br>
>From a collection care point of view, fire protection or toxicity problems - for me - would not be a proper reason if in the long run the new condition would harm the integrity of the specimen.<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
<br>
Also, because of the acidity, I would refrain of changing the fluid unless there is a real good reason to do so (maybe part of the collection, or specific specimens from a lot containing several specimens for a specific research purpose).<br>
<br>
Btw:<br>
Mahoney (1973) Laboratory Techniques in Zoology gives the following recipes (Pick-Judah formula)<br>
(Simon, please comment if this wouldn't make sense)<br>
<br>
KI (fixative)<br>
Potassium acetate 42.5g<br>
Potassium nitrate 22.5g<br>
Distilled water 1.6 L<br>
40% formalin solution 400ml (full strength)<br>
<br>
Salt are dissolved in hot water, formalin is added to the cooled solution<br>
<br>
KII (colour reviver)<br>
EtOH 96 %<br>
<br>
KIII (perservative)<br>
Sodium acetate 36.0g<br>
Distilled water 120.0ml<br>
Camphor 5.0ml (4% EtOH solution)<br>
Glycerol 72ml<br>
<br>
(The solution is made by adding the ingredients in the order given. At first, the camphor is thrown out of solution but redissolves on allowing the solution to stand)<br>
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All the best<br>
Dirk</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<br>
Am 16.08.2017 um 13:19 schrieb Simon Moore:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Hi Juliette,<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">No problem about getting in touch.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">You mention re-packing a collection. Is this collection to be moved or stored or did you mean that is needs to be moved into safer fluids? The latter is indicative of a move for museums with such collections to be rid
of fluids that are flammable and/or toxic.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">There are various concerns about this as the condition of the specimens is what should be the real issue here. As you are based at LeHavre I am assuming that you should have many marine organisms in fluids? For many
such organisms a move to Kaiserling III will be fine but you have to bear in mind that the osmotic pressure of KIII is considerably different to that of ethanol, even formalin. For delicate organisms (medusae, siphonophores) this changeover has to be carried
out very carefully or you will end up with air bubbles inside them that appear when binary/tertiary azeotropes are used - miscible fluids of different specific gravities. You also need to bear in mind that Kaiserling’s technique was devised mainly for anatomy
specimens as the preservative is good for maintaining the colour of blood and organs that filter it (liver, kidney). I have successfully colour-preserved marine organisms that were freshly collected and using the 3 stage technique - fixation, colour enhancement
and preservation.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">All of this may sound rather negative but I am just warning you to be careful with the changeover. I would also post the enquiry onto the conservation forum:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a href="mailto:nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</span></a><span lang="EN-US"> to
see if anyone else is doing this and to see if they have any concerns.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">The formula for the Kaiserling method is: </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">Kaiserling I (fixative): 40% formaldehyde (400) [tlv 3], potassium acetate (50 g), potassium
nitrate (30 g), distilled water (1000).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Bookman Old Style","serif"">Kaiserling II (enhancer/colour restorer): 80-90% ethanol. Use until colour returns if it has chemically ‘faded’ in fixative – may be minutes for smaller
specimens. Some like to add some potassium hydrosulphite if being stored for more than a few days.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span lang="EN-GB">Kaiserling III (preservative): Potassium acetate (200g), glycerol (300), distilled water (900).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">With all good wishes, Simon.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Simon Moore MIScT, RSci, FLS, ACR<br>
Conservator of Natural Sciences and Cutlery Historian,<br>
</span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.natural-2Dhistory-2Dconservation.com&d=DwMFaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=MxsNB9i59J38j_fgIMI_hJkw5F2sMUmH0Nl7mDt2jiY&s=Q68m7UHxI0JOb8NE7fTQh74O6YrzMiczUotWcxiwwDk&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">www.natural-history-conservation.com</span></a><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">On 16 Aug 2017, at 10:37, Galpin Juliette <</span><a href="mailto:juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr</span></a><span lang="EN-US">> wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Hello,<span class="m-2817061451362062073apple-converted-space"> </span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">My name is Juliette Galpin and I’m in charge of all the scientific collection in the Natural History Museum of Le Havre, in France.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">I’m following the advice of Judith White, in Natural History Museum, who told me to get in touch with you. Hope you won’t mind.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">We have a collection which is maintained in fluids, and we want to repack it. The specimens are currently in liquid as Alcool, Ethanol and a bit of Formol. And
we wish to recondition it in Kaiserling III, which is a mixture of glycerin and acetate of potassium without any formol. I don’t know if you know, or use, this liquid.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">I’ve found some of your papers about collections in fluids, but there is few literature about Kaiserling precisely, and I don’t really know how to create this
liquid correctly.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Do you know this product, or someone who might know and use it, or maybe know the process to adapt the specimens to their new conservation fluid ?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Thank you very much for your answer and all the help you can provide me,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Regards.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Juliette Galpin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""><image001.jpg></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Juliette GALPIN</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><br>
In charge of Natural history Collections</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Natural history Museum<br>
Ville du Havre<br>
</span><a href="mailto:juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:purple">juliette.galpin@lehavre.fr</span></a><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><br>
Tél. : 02 35 54 75 89 / 02.32.74.79.90</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<pre><span lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Nhcoll-l mailing list</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:Nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">Nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a href="http://mailman.yale.edu/mailman/listinfo/nhcoll-l" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://mailman.yale.edu/mailman/listinfo/nhcoll-l</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________ </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">NHCOLL-L is brought to you by the Society for the Preservation of</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Natural History Collections (SPNHC), an international society whose</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">mission is to improve the preservation, conservation and management of</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">natural history collections to ensure their continuing value to</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">society. See </span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.spnhc.org&d=DwMDaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=pvvpRadzkLThc5xskCfF53deRfBugyuz3LHZnefk8Lk&s=x_9HrMFy2ZApgIJmdrCYbtxavfwuFewUcVgZ8E-Bj-4&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://www.spnhc.org</span></a><span lang="EN-US"> for membership information.</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Advertising on NH-COLL-L is inappropriate.</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">-- </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Dirk Neumann</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Tel: 089 / 8107-111</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Fax: 089 / 8107-300</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">email: Dirk.Neumann(a)</span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__zsm.mwn.de_&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=mocj_ofrgXYQip8ffZCQfrQI-JTiahHC8tiJHpI6vjM&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">zsm.mwn.de</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Postanschrift:</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Staatliche Naturwissenschaftliche Sammlungen Bayerns</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Zoologische Staatssammlung München</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Dirk Neumann, Sektion Ichthyologie / DNA-Storage</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Münchhausenstr. 21</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">81247 München</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Besuchen Sie unsere Sammlung:</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.zsm.mwn.de_ich_&d=DwMDaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=pvvpRadzkLThc5xskCfF53deRfBugyuz3LHZnefk8Lk&s=8Zh0xUjYqJupqeAd7-PNK6RCW0nhvxm9IA-6D27jobw&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://www.zsm.mwn.de/ich/</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">---------</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Dirk Neumann</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Tel: </span><a href="tel:+49%2089%208107111" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">+49-89-8107-111</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Fax: </span><a href="tel:+49%2089%208107300" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">+49-89-8107-300</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">email: Dirk.Neumann(a)</span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__zsm.mwn.de_&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=mocj_ofrgXYQip8ffZCQfrQI-JTiahHC8tiJHpI6vjM&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">zsm.mwn.de</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">postal address:</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Bavarian Natural History Collections</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">The Bavarian State Collection of Zoology</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Dirk Neumann, Section Ichthyology / DNA-Storage</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Muenchhausenstr. 21</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">81247 Munich (Germany)</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US">Visit our section at:</span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.zsm.mwn.de_ich_&d=DwMDaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=pvvpRadzkLThc5xskCfF53deRfBugyuz3LHZnefk8Lk&s=8Zh0xUjYqJupqeAd7-PNK6RCW0nhvxm9IA-6D27jobw&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://www.zsm.mwn.de/ich/</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span lang="EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></pre>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Nhcoll-l mailing list<br>
</span><a href="mailto:Nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">Nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><br>
</span><a href="http://mailman.yale.edu/mailman/listinfo/nhcoll-l" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://mailman.yale.edu/mailman/listinfo/nhcoll-l</span></a><span lang="EN-US"><br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
NHCOLL-L is brought to you by the Society for the Preservation of<br>
Natural History Collections (SPNHC), an international society whose<br>
mission is to improve the preservation, conservation and management of<br>
natural history collections to ensure their continuing value to<br>
society. See<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.spnhc.org_&d=DwMGaQ&c=cjytLXgP8ixuoHflwc-poQ&r=LpYc_Z_iN1KRw0hheb3x6-8MJUMu482qfHowpGYJqwc&m=DDLDmZjdGZy43jnYILyX3W4UVINrZKKvLB57ry2H9kk&s=Z8QyMxJey6eoStDueM7Muv8qs4YeBtn-nrqs1Wr1e-8&e=" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:purple">http://www.spnhc.org</span></a><span class="apple-converted-space"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></span><span lang="EN-US">for
membership information.<br>
Advertising on NH-COLL-L is inappropriate.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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