<div dir="ltr"><div>Just to be pedantic, there's variation in whether databases are constructed with separate location and event tables, or take a unified view towards a location/event. Separate tables are useful in cases where there is repeat sampling at a single location. <br></div><div><br></div><div>But that said... we, too, would likely declare those to be separate events (also separate specimen lots — we'd likely separate them into two containers). In a slightly more debatable decision, we may also create separate "events" when a single sample is split between ethanol and formalin preservative. <br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">-Dean<br>-- <br>Dean Pentcheff<br><a href="mailto:pentcheff@gmail.com" target="_blank">pentcheff@gmail.com</a></div><div dir="ltr"><a href="mailto:dpentche@nhm.org" target="_blank">pentcheff@nhm.org</a><br><a href="https://research.nhm.org/disco" target="_blank">https://research.nhm.org/disco</a></div><div dir="ltr"><img src="http://research.nhm.org/images/DISCO_lockup_4color-300.png"><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Apr 12, 2024 at 12:50 AM Tom Schiøtte <<a href="mailto:tschioette@snm.ku.dk">tschioette@snm.ku.dk</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg3675584203495811591">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hi Nate,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">I agree with Brian (and yourself apparently). In our setup collecting gear is part of the event record as is a field for ‘Fresh water/Marine/Terrestrial’. These only give meaning
when two events are recorded.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Cheers<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Tom<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Tom Schiøtte</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Collection manager, Echinodermata & Mollusca</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Natural History Museum of Denmark (Zoology)</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Universitetsparken 15</span></b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">DK 2100 Copenhagen OE</span></b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">+45 35 32 10 48</span></b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="mailto:TSchioette@snm.ku.dk" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue">TSchioette@snm.ku.dk</span></a></span></b><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DA" style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Nhcoll-l <<a href="mailto:nhcoll-l-bounces@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank">nhcoll-l-bounces@mailman.yale.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Sidlauskas, Brian<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 12. april 2024 02:15<br>
<b>To:</b> Shoobs, Nate <<a href="mailto:shoobs.1@osu.edu" target="_blank">shoobs.1@osu.edu</a>>; <a href="mailto:nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank">nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Nhcoll-l] How does your collection handle sites with multiple habitats sampled?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Nate,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Figured I’d respond to this one, since I’m asking you for more caliper advice.
<span style="font-family:"Segoe UI Symbol",sans-serif">😉</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">This sounds like a case of one locality with two different collecting events. Even when a team is targeting all the same nominal taxon (e.g., just fishes, or just insects, or whatever) I think the differences in collecting method (trap
versus seine versus shocker) are relevant when more than one method is used at a site. So, I’d record this as two separate collecting events with different associated data in the collection method field. There might also be differences in fields like depth,
start time and end time. I’d probably record the microhabitat details in a free text field (not the locality description).
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Best Fishes, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">---- Brian<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:rgb(227,108,10)">____________________________________</span><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Brian Sidlauskas</span></b><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Professor and Curator of Fishes</span><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Department of Fisheries, Wildlife and Conservation Sciences</span><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Nhcoll-l <<a href="mailto:nhcoll-l-bounces@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank">nhcoll-l-bounces@mailman.yale.edu</a>> on behalf of "Shoobs, Nate" <<a href="mailto:shoobs.1@osu.edu" target="_blank">shoobs.1@osu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, April 11, 2024 at 6:39 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"<a href="mailto:nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank">nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</a>" <<a href="mailto:nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu" target="_blank">nhcoll-l@mailman.yale.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>[Nhcoll-l] How does your collection handle sites with multiple habitats sampled?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p><span style="color:rgb(215,63,9)">[This email originated from outside of OSU. Use caution with links and attachments.]</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hey all,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">This one is for those of you who manage “collecting events” as a separate table or group of tables in a relational database, with a one-to-many relationship to collection objects or specimen lots. I’d like to hear some different perspectives
on how your collection would handle the following situation:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">A jar containing 5 species of 5 species of land snails bears the following collecting data:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“Blue River at Rt. 101 Bridge, 5 mi N of Anywhere, USA. Station BS-2024-100. Crayfish seined from 1-2 ft of water in 1 pass, snails abundant on bank vegetation. B. Smith, 11-April-2024!”<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">We know these specimens share a locality, collector, date of collection, etc. But the specific habitat is different, and taxonomists focusing on either group (crayfish or snails) might write the locality a bit differently, for example,
a crayfish biologist might write “Blue River at…” whereas a terrestrial malacologist might prefer “Along bank of Blue River at…” to indicate more clearly that the specimens were not found in the river itself. Furthermore, the gear type and method of collecting
is different (the crayfish were caught in a seine, but the snails were hand-caught on vegetation.)<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Would this be one collecting event in your collection, or two? How would you parse the data, and why?<u></u><u></u></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><u></u> <u></u></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">(Assume that both the crayfish and snails are in-scope for your collection, of course.)<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In my personal collecting, I have always treated “in” and “out” of the water as different stations even when at the same place, but I don’t want to impose my personal preference on our collection here without seeing what others do.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">-Nate<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">--<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:13.5pt;background:white">
<span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:rgb(51,51,51)"><img border="0" width="224" height="45" style="width: 2.3333in; height: 0.4687in;" id="m_3675584203495811591Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:ii_18f2c37699b5b16b22" alt="The Ohio State University"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:rgb(187,0,0);background:white">Nathaniel F. Shoobs</span></b><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:rgb(51,51,51)"><br>
Curator of Mollusks<br>
</span><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:rgb(187,0,0);background:white">College of Arts & Sciences</span><span style="font-size:9pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:rgb(51,51,51)"> Dept. of Evolution,
Ecology, and Organismal Biology<br>
Museum of Biological Diversity, 1315 Kinnear Rd, Columbus, OH 43212<br>
614-688-1342 (Office)<br>
<a href="http://mbd.osu.edu/" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(5,99,193);background:white">mbd.osu.edu</span></a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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