Photos of urban monarch overwintering sites in California

RENE BOUTIN rboutin at sympatico.ca
Fri Jan 12 10:37:18 EST 2001


I think what Mr.Jones is doing is choosing the largest possible ennemy so we
all think he is large, being cozy across the ocean.
            I guess it's kneel down jones time for him......
 
Martha Rosett Lutz wrote:
 
> Oh dear.  It's January, Iowa got hit with record-breaking amounts of snow,
> and the only insect 'sighting' I have had in months (other than our dear
> little box elder bugs that overwinter indoors) was a frozen pentatomid in a
> bag of green peas (brand name on request if you want to try to find one of
> your own).  But in spite of that, most things were going along cheerfully.
>
> Until the 'Monarch photos' thread got rolling.
>
> The thread itself has all sorts of interesting aspects that merit
> discussion.  Someone raised the point that there is a vital difference
> between species that are transient and dormant, versus those that make
> their living in the habitat under discussion.  I learn a lot from this sort
> of interchange of ideas.
>
> I sometimes find myself persuaded to adopt new viewpoints, think in new
> ways, and search for new evidence to learn more about an idea that develops
> from things I learn via discussions on the list.
>
> Now . . . I wish I could find a way to explain to Mr. Neil Jones that,
> generally, the use of sarcasm, invective, or contumely will more often be
> counterproductive than persuasive.
>
> For example, I try to always be open-minded, listed to evidence, and draw
> logical conclusions, and I try to be wary of partial data sets that seem to
> point one way when the entire data set would actually point the other way.
> HOWEVER, remarks such as:
>
> "Perhaps you could all form a nice little club together.
> I can even suggest a title. How about "Friends of the Vandals"."
>
> give me the same feeling I get when I start to peel an orange and suddenly
> my fingers sink into a mushy area.  (Yuck--I don't want to have anything
> more to do with this one.)
>
> I would like to be able to open notes posted by all members of the list,
> and to evaluate their comments for myself based on their evidence and my
> own experience.  When I find that aggressive invective is the predominant
> component of a particular person's notes, I find myself more and more often
> deleting that person's notes without even peeking to see if they had
> something interesting or informative to say.
>
> Please, Mr. Jones, if you want to retain credibility with people like
> myself (some of us only know you through the list), try to restrain
> contumely; please use documentation, evidence, logic, and the other tools
> of science.  Your use of comments such as the above has a high probability
> of reducing your effective audience to those who already agree with you and
> those who feel that they are being attacked (and therefore want to know
> what you are saying about them).
>
> Perhaps I am wrong in assuming that you would like to persuade people to
> consider your viewpoints and adopt your ideas.  If I am wrong, then I
> apologize for this comment on your methodology.  If I am right, however, I
> beg you to consider the real effect your choice of language may
> produce--i.e. to alienate some of the people who ought to be part of your
> target audience.
>
> This is not written specifically in defense of Mr. Cherubini, but rather in
> defense of courtesy as a valuable means of creating attentive audiences for
> important messages.  I hope it is perceived as such by most members of the
> leps list!!!
>
> Thanks for your time.
>
> In Stride,
> Martha Rosett Lutz
>
>
>  ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>    For subscription and related information about LEPS-L visit:
>
>    http://www.peabody.yale.edu/other/lepsl
>
 
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: rboutin.vcf
Type: text/x-vcard
Size: 0 bytes
Desc: Card for RENE BOUTIN
Url : http://mailman.yale.edu/mailman/private/leps-l/attachments/20010112/2441818d/attachment.vcf 


More information about the Leps-l mailing list