[leps-talk], logic and PETA?

Wed Apr 30 14:07:07 EDT 2003

You sound most logical in your reasoning,  Admiral...  I had something
emerge when I woke up, too... I think it was a PETA... Spock
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Gatrelle" <gatrelle at tils-ttr.org>
To: <tils-leps-talk at yahoogroups.com>; <neil at nwjones.demon.co.uk>
Cc: <leps-l at lists.yale.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 12:17 PM
Subject: Re: [leps-talk], logic and PETA?

----- Original Message -----
From: <neil at nwjones.demon.co.uk>
Subject: [leps-talk] Harry Pavulaan's gift to PETA?

snip
> Without the rules of logic we have no science. What ever your value
judgements on evidence or precaution in this instance, if you make or
defend an argument that violates logic, the core of the scientific method,
you are not being scientific.<

Good points Neil.   I think that sometimes the problem is that your use of
the term logic is interpreted by some as meaning singularly absolute, that
is, without options or other possible conclusions.   But this is not the
case.   Reasoning is the nucleus of logic.  But reasoning can be by
deduction or induction.  The logic produced by deductive reasoning is by
nature subtractive (deduct).  The logic produced by inductive reasoning is
by nature injective (assert).     By either means, the variability and
subjectivity of "facts" or "concepts" put forth by any given proponent is
why in science we call the product of logic an hypothesis.  In other words,
the conclusion or premise is subject to further information or opinion.
This is why in philosophy there is no such thing as ultimate truth.   In
science we look for absolute truth - also elusive as it is usually
conditional due to some known or unknown scenario that might alter said
truth.  Well, I need to move on....

On this subject of "commercial breeding and releases" there are two or more
sides competing for constituents - agreement with their positions.   Those
in the gallery are those potential allies or opponents.   Logic is
essential.  But it functions only via deductive and/or inductive reasoning
and has the ability to draw from both tangible and intangible factors -
including instinct.    Each side has "enough" facts (reasons from reasoning
= logic) to support their own agenda.  Thus, each side's adamancy is
derived from their agendistic orientation not their logic.   That is, the
more passionate (closed minded) the adherent, the more insulted and
insulting they are.

I'll quit here or what will come next will just be what I see, why I see it
that way, and then degrees of insults.   Well, I'll give just one.  I'll
skip all my "logic" and just give my conclusion.  I consider PETA composed
mostly of idiots and envior-terrorists.    See how easy it is to be
logical?

Ron Gatrelle

PS  Neil, it was a good post as we do have to consider what we may be
inferring when our statement are applied in another direction.

PPS  I note how this thread got started over on leps-talk.  I see that
there was virtually no activity on leps-l for some time until this
leps-talk thread eventually got cross posted.  I note this has happened
before.  I note that there have been 431 to date there for April.  I deduce
that leps-talk is a more active group, which I postulate is because it is
more interesting.   _I conclude_ that folks who want more leps chat should
be subscribed to leps-talk (at Yahoo!groups).  _Others conclude_ this PPS
is a commercial and akin to a pop up ad   )-:    Is this evidence of
absence or absence of evidence - or both?   I say both - esp. since I have
been absent from most the evidence (if one can call a list serve thread
evidence).

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