Monarch Mexican Migration and land management

[Grkovich, Alex]

All this talks about the Monarch overwintering sites are "interesting", but
there may be an equal or perhaps an even bigger threat going on within our
own U.S. borders, to MANY species of all animal (and plant) groups...

I have made three visits to San Antonio, Texas in the past year, in order to
visit a friend (which is of course a good excuse to go and collect)...and
have been increasingly shocked at the scope of very extensive and VERY
poorly planned "housing developments" going on there...One area where in
particular I have watched this "progress" is on the west side of the city,
where hundreds upon hundreds of acres of beautiful Lower Austral habitat are
being cleared - razed, bulldozed to dust, to well below the soil, and are
being replaced by hundreds upon hundreds of blocks of "housing
projects"...and where this "development" has not yet taken place, all one
sees is signs advertisement future "Green Acres" or "Sierra Acres" or
something such...NOTHING whatsoever of the vegetation at all is being left
behind, and the "houses" are little more than $80,000 to $125,000 paper
shacks with a clean and pretty facade...At first, I also thought how nice
that the outer ring around the west of the city, Rt. 1604, is being
converted from a two lane country (sub-suburban road) to a freeway, which
will no doubt all too soon be choked and clogged with the same levels of
"traffic" that is now choking freeways all over our country (including in
San Antonio itself, despite the fact that for example, I-410 has 12 lanes in
some areas...and try getting from Boston to Portland, Maine sometime...once
you manage to clear the "traffic", it all builds up again at the "toll
booths")...until it was pointed out to me that the state is applying for the
expansion of the highway to "accommodate" the perhqps hundreds of thousands
of new residents who are apparently in many cases being imported from
surrounding regions (i.e. states) into these virtual "ghettos". Already the
cost in terms of social "progress" is being felt into these areas...these
"ghettos are fast becoming drug and crime-infested...This has nothing to do
with urban planning...it has little more to do with anything other than the
making of a quick and cheap buck by the "developers" at the expense of the
community, of the residents of surrounding, better-planned neighborhoods and
area, and finally of the current and future residents of these "ghettos",
who probably are being sucked-in to buy in these "communities...And finally
to the natural residents - plant and animal - which have and are being
devastated and wiped out.

I have seen the  same "progress" going on in large scale around Orlando,
Florida and in many other areas...and from what I understand, perhaps
destroying what's left of the lower Rio Grande Valley is next on the agenda
of these "carpertbaggers"?

God forbid.

How about some comments and some action on bringing to a halt THESE threats
to our environment as well as to our society and to our social wealth, Pat,
Lincoln and Chip and others involved in "saving the Monarch"...compared to
all this I'm afraid that the Monarch may be doing quite OK...and I saw them
active in San Antonio as well as in south Texas last weekend... 

Alex

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Patrick Foley [SMTP:patfoley at csus.edu]
> Sent:	Friday, November 21, 2003 10:47 AM
> To:	monarch at saber.net
> Cc:	LEPS-L at lists.yale.edu
> Subject:	Re: Monarch Mexican Migration and land management
> 
> Paul,
> 
> So your theory about Monarch winter sites is that everything is cool in 
> Mexico, and in California we should be planting more Eucalyptus, a 
> highly flammable introduced tree.
> 
> Its hard to figure why your ideas are not embraced by the scientific 
> community.
> 
> Wouldn't it be OK to spend just a little money on land preservation and 
> scientific research? The cost here is pretty small compared to, for 
> example, bailing out ENRON CEO's or spraying DDT over all the wetlands 
> and waterways of the USA, a few of our oldies-but-goodies. And just 
> possibly, the work that Brower's team is doing will reveal more about 
> the oyamel fir forest than the assurances you make.
> 
> As a masters student at U Az years ago, I heard the Canadian ecologist 
> E. C. Pielou give a talk on the biogeography of brown algae. One of the 
> very junior faculty somewhat haughtily asked her why she thought this 
> research was of any scientific interest.
> 
> Steadily, pointedly, she made her reply, "Some of us believe that much 
> can be learned about the world by actually looking at it."
> 
> Patrick
> 
> Paul Cherubini wrote:
> 
> > Pat Foley wrote:
> > 
> > 
> >>I am perfectly willing to give you credit for your observations and
> >>insights about Monarch roosting behavior and the possibility that the
> >>Brower group is overly committed to a simplistic model. But if your
> >>alternative to the Brower model is to do nothing, to protect nothing,...
> > 
> > 
> > Well, what needs to be done?  Like do we need to finance reforestation
> > programs at the altitude where the monarchs overwinter? No, because
> > there is practically no logging damage that needs to be repaired.
> > 
> > Do we need to finance reforestation programs below the altitude where
> > the monarch overwinter?  Not generally, because low altitude forests are
> 
> > not used by the butterflies as overwintering habitat.  However, the 
> > monarchs commonly find drinking water on the cropland immediately
> > below the sanctuaries http://www.saber.net/~monarch/kurt2.JPG  
> > (obviously a benefit). In addition, nectar sources such as sunflowers
> > commonly grow as weeds on this cropland 
> > http://www.saber.net/~monarch/arriving2.jpg (photo lifted from
> > Journey North website).
> > 
> > Do we need to finance reforestation programs to repair occassional
> forest 
> > fire damage? No, because the forest regenerates on it's own.  
> > 
> > Is the human population in the monarch reserve area rising rapidly? 
> > No, because as in rural areas of the USA, the young people tend to
> > migrate to the larger cities to find better educational and employment
> > opportunities.  
> > 
> > Do we need to finance studies about the "appropriate land management 
> > policy for Monarch winter sites and learn more about the autecology
> > of overwintering Monarchs?"  No, because current and past land use
> > use practices have n proved to be compatible with monarch overwintering.
> 
> > 
> > Paul Cherubini
> > 
> >  
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