[SoWestLep] Glassberg Article in Birding

Fri Mar 11 12:41:31 EST 2005

Let me just add something about the "Northeast"...

The fact is that, compared to other parts of the U.S., the "northeast" appears to be fairly straightforward and many if not most Butterfly and Skipper species can be readily identified by Field Marks in the field, with or without the aid of binoculars...This is certainly quite in contrast to the immense taxonomic confusion that continues to exist out West...and which in fact appears to be expanding...

However...the above statement is actually true at the surface only. The Northeast is also the tension zone between many southern, northern, and even western taxa...and the relationships between a surprising number of groups of butterflies, we are finding, are hardly  well understood at this time. Folks in the Northeast may see a Crescent for example, and have no idea whatsoever what they are looking at. The same may hold true for a Megisto, a Satyrodes, a Tiger Swallowtail etc....For example, was the Tiger Swallowtail that was seen late last June or early last July in central Massachusetts an Eastern Tiger (glaucus), a Canadian Tiger (canadensis), a northern subspecies of the Appalachian Tiger (appalachiensis), an undescribed species perhaps, or a hybrid between any of the above? Was the Crescent a Pearl (tharos), a Mimic (incognitus), a Diminutor (diminutor), a Northern (cocyta), or perhaps again an undescribed species - or even perhaps an orantain???...I just received, as a matter of fact, an e-mail last night from Niklas Wahlberg in which he stated that, based upon his ongoing DNA analyses to date, that the "tharos" group of Crescents (which is well-represented in the "Northeast", with multiple and quite confusing broods appearing throughout the course of a season in south-central New England) appears to be in his opinion a "superspecies"...To date, these are all being reported here as "Pearl Crescents", or in a few cases as "Northern Crescents"...but closer examination of these so-called "Northern Crescents" will at once reveal significant phenotypic differences between them and the true Northern Crescent (cocyta - now identified as cocyta by DNA analysis) which occurs further north in Maine and beyond...

So, we can see that even in the relatively unconfusing Northeast, the true situation is hardly simple and straightforward; and that a whole lot of taxonomic work remains...

Alex

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Todd Stout [SMTP:todd_stout29 at hotmail.com]
> Sent:	Friday, March 11, 2005 12:04 PM
> To:	hbrodkin at cox.net; leps-l at lists.yale.edu; TILS-leps-talk at yahoogroups.com; tx-butterfly at listserv.uh.edu; sowestlep at yahoogroups.com
> Cc:	leesu47 at aol.com; raberg2 at earthlink.net
> Subject:	RE: [SoWestLep] Glassberg Article in Birding
> 
> 
> Great post Hank!
> 
> When you say, "Where would Jeff be without the shoulders of the collectors 
> who preceded him?"  I think that is a strong point.  Just to add to that:  I 
> am of the impression that Jeff himself was a collector once upon a time.  
> (At least, that is what I've been told.)
> 
> I think, and this is just my opinion, what made him bitterly anti-collecting 
> is the incident with Neonympha mitchelli becoming extirpated in New Jersey.  
> Some say it was habitat degradation that caused the butterfly to disappear; 
> others blamed it on overcollecting.  (I personally don't know which is 
> correct; or even if a combination of the two played a role.)
> 
> Although I don't agree with his agenda and distortions of reality, I have to 
> admit that I too feel bitterly angry about butterfly habitats being 
> destroyed.  (I have an example that is too close to home).
> 
> I live in the North end of Salt Lake City, and, as of three years ago, had 
> the privelege of living about 1500 feet (just across I-215) from a habitat 
> which our ULS web site calls "Wasatch Wet Meadows".  It's a Russian > 
> Olive--milkweed, tall grass wet type habitat that had healthy colonies of 
> Ceononympha tullia ampelos, Hemiargus isola, and Cercyonis pegala 
> utahensis==arianne; amongst others.  It also attracted migrant Monarchs as 
> they would roost on the Russian Olive Trees during the heat of our summer 
> days and oviposit on the nearby milkweeds.
> 
> Now, as I look out my window, instead of a meadow, I see a large industrial 
> building and bulldozers destroying the rest of the habitat.  Needless to 
> say, those two satyrids are gone from that spot.  (I looked long and hard to 
> find them last year in the remains and was unsuccessful.)
> 
> To be honest, I'm beyond bitter about never seeing those butterflies there 
> again.  I know that neither those spp. nor their respective ssp. are 
> endangered; but still, it's very upsetting.
> 
> I'm all for home building and industrialization.  I just wish that certain 
> habitats (i.e, wet meadows or wetlands) could be left alone.  (in my 
> opinion.)
> 
> P.S.  I hope this thread doesn't annoy Doug since a butterfly watcher (Hank) 
> is showing examples of the benefits of collecting; whereas an avid butterfly 
> collector (myself) is discussing the benefits of conservation.
> 
> Thanks, Todd
> 
> 
> 
> Todd L. Stout
> todd_stout29 at hotmail.com
> (801) 322-2049 (Home)
> (801) 558-6302 (Mobile)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >From: "Hank Brodkin" <hbrodkin at cox.net>
> >To: "Leps-l" <leps-l at lists.yale.edu>,"Tils" 
> ><TILS-leps-talk at yahoogroups.com>,"Texas Butterfly List" 
> ><tx-butterfly at listserv.uh.edu>,"Southwest Lep group" 
> ><sowestlep at yahoogroups.com>
> >CC: "Libby Sullivan" <leesu47 at aol.com>,"Rich Bailowitz" 
> ><raberg2 at earthlink.net>
> >Subject: [SoWestLep] Glassberg Article in Birding
> >Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 08:41:05 -0700
> >
> >In the new March/April issue of BIRDING there is an article "The Birth of 
> >Butterflying" by Jeffrey Glassberg where Jeff seems to take single handed 
> >credit for the birth of this avocation.  It distresses us that there is no 
> >mention of Robert Michael Pyle, the prize-winning naturalist and 
> >conservationist whose book, which preceded Jeff's guides,  Jeff mentions 
> >but not the man.
> >
> >He also seems to be extending the collecting debate into a type of class 
> >warfare mentioning at one point the "stigma of netting".
> >
> >I quote a portion of the article:
> >"In the Northeast, large numbers of butterfliers are very active in the 
> >field and have developed very excellent field-identification skills.  In 
> >some northeastern parks, one is more likely to encounter groups of 
> >butterflyers than birders.  In contrast, in parts of the West, much of the 
> >discussion is still dominated by a small group of collectors and netters - 
> >but this will rapidly change."
> >
> >I am sure that the many active butterfly enthusiasts in Texas, California. 
> >Oregon. Washington, Arizona and elsewhere will be happy to learn this.
> >
> >Ironically there are two strips of pinned specimens decorating the page 
> >edges of the article.
> >
> >Where would Jeff be without the shoulders of the collectors who preceded 
> >him?  How often has Jeff studied collections in museums and elsewhere to 
> >increase HIS knowledge?  AND WHY DOES HE INSIST ON TRYING TO BUILD A DIVIDE 
> >BETWEEN PEOPLE WHOSE INTERESTS AND LOVE OF BUTTERFLIES ARE EQUAL TO HIS 
> >OWN.
> >
> >Hank Brodkin
> >Member of the SEABA Chapter of NABA
> >Carr Canyon, AZ
> >hbrodkin at cox.net
> >Butterflies of Arizona - a Photographic Guide
> >http://members.cox.net/hbrodkin
> >
> >
> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
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