[Nhcoll-l] Fluid preservation correction

Fri May 21 03:15:12 EDT 2021

Dear Julian, Simon and Andrew Charles,

Thanks for all your answers, they were very helpful.

One more question appeared when i read your answers: How to collect specimens for fluid preservation? (For example frog). Do i first inject formaline to the body and then put it also to formaline and then when i return to lab I put it in EtOH? Or some better solutions?

Sincerely,
Joosep Sarapuu
Estonian Museum of Natural History

From: Julian Carter [mailto:Julian.Carter at museumwales.ac.uk]
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2021 1:56 AM
To: Simon Moore <couteaufin at btinternet.com>; Bentley, Andrew Charles <abentley at ku.edu>
Cc: NHCOLL-new <nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu>; Joosep Sarapuu <Joosep.Sarapuu at loodusmuuseum.ee>
Subject: Re: [Nhcoll-l] Fluid preservation correction

Any fixation in formalin will have a notable effect on the viability of the DNA for later research, even for a few days. There are a complex mix of factors occurring such as crosslinking effects, hydrolytic degradation, the acidity of a solution altering conformations and functional group arrangements etc. Most damage to the DNA will occur at point of death of the organism, how quickly it is preserved, and how it is preserved. Thus Andy's comment rightly points out that subsequent fixation and preservation treatments may have already subsequently effected the quality of the preserved DNA.

Cheers

Jules

Prif Gadwraethydd, Gwyddorau Naturiol / Principal Conservator Natural Sciences
julian.carter at amgueddfacymru.ac.uk<mailto:julian.carter at amgueddfacymru.ac.uk>
julian.carter at museumwales.ac.uk<mailto:julian.carter at museumwales.ac.uk>
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Julian_Carter
Twitter: @NatHistConserve
Ffon/Tel: (+44) 029 20573230 / (+44)07870448074

________________________________
From: Nhcoll-l <nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> on behalf of Simon Moore <couteaufin at btinternet.com<mailto:couteaufin at btinternet.com>>
Sent: 20 May 2021 23:09
To: Bentley, Andrew Charles <abentley at ku.edu<mailto:abentley at ku.edu>>
Cc: NHCOLL-new <nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu>>; Joosep Sarapuu <Joosep.Sarapuu at loodusmuuseum.ee<mailto:Joosep.Sarapuu at loodusmuuseum.ee>>
Subject: Re: [Nhcoll-l] Fluid preservation correction

I don’t think that a fixation in formalin can alter DNA for a few days provided the samples is transferred into 96% EtOH as soon as possible after fixation and that no formaldehyde is still present (via the sample) in the preservative fluid. I am unsure of there is a critical level for formalin presence that might compromise DNA.

With all good wishes, Simon

Simon Moore MIScT, RSci, FLS, ACR
Conservator of Natural Sciences and Cutlery Historian,

www.natural-history-conservation.com<http://www.natural-history-conservation.com>

> On 20 May 2021, at 19:52, Bentley, Andrew Charles <abentley at ku.edu<mailto:abentley at ku.edu>> wrote:
>
> Julian
>
> That is presuming that the specimens were not first fixed in formalin before being placed in 95% ethanol.
>
> Andy
>
>      A  :                A  :               A  :
>  }<(((_°>.,.,.,.}<(((_°>.,.,.,.}<)))_°>
>      V                   V                  V
> Andy Bentley
> Ichthyology Collection Manager
> University of Kansas
> Biodiversity Institute
> Dyche Hall
> 1345 Jayhawk Boulevard
> Lawrence, KS, 66045-7561
> USA
>
> Tel: (785) 864-3863
> Fax: (785) 864-5335
> Email: abentley at ku.edu<mailto:abentley at ku.edu>
> http://ichthyology.biodiversity.ku.edu
>
>      A  :                A  :                A  :
>  }<(((_°>.,.,.,.}<(((_°>.,.,.,.}<)))_°>
>      V                   V                   V
>
>
> From: Nhcoll-l <nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> on behalf of "Julian uk>" <Julian.Carter at museumwales.ac.uk<mailto:Julian.Carter at museumwales.ac.uk>>
> Date: Thursday, May 20, 2021 at 1:51 PM
> To: Joosep Sarapuu <Joosep.Sarapuu at loodusmuuseum.ee<mailto:Joosep.Sarapuu at loodusmuuseum.ee>>, "nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu>" <nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu>>
> Subject: Re: [Nhcoll-l] Fluid preservation correction
>
> Hi Joosep,
>
> 96% Ethanol (with no additives) will actually be better for DNA preservation as it effectively dehydrates the specimen and reduces hydrolytic effects. So I’d keep them in the 96% EtOH. ‘Cold and dry’ tends to be best for biomolecule preservation.
>
> As to the denatured EtOH – then probably best to transfer into equivalent absolute ethanol. The ‘denaturant’ used can be very variable though usually something like MEK or Methanol, both of which are better avoided with DNA samples.
>
> Hope that helps.
>
> All the best,
>
> Jules
>
>
> Julian Carter (he/him)
> Prif Gadwraethydd, Gwyddorau Naturiol / Principal Conservator Natural Sciences
> julian.carter at amgueddfacymru.ac.uk<mailto:julian.carter at amgueddfacymru.ac.uk>
> julian.carter at museumwales.ac.uk<mailto:julian.carter at museumwales.ac.uk>
> https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Julian_Carter
> Twitter: @NatHistConserve
> Ffon/Tel: (+44) 029 20573230 / (+44)07870448074
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Nhcoll-l <nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> On Behalf Of Joosep Sarapuu
> Sent: 20 May 2021 14:12
> To: nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:nhcoll-l at mailman.yale.edu>
> Subject: [Nhcoll-l] Fluid preservation correction
>
> Dear all,
>
> I have a question about fluid preservation correction.
>        • I have three samples of animals in 96% EtOH right now, but i know that the best for DNA would be 75% EtOH. Can i just dilute this to the right amount or i have to wash it in destilled water and then step by step to 75% EtOH?
>        • I have one animal in denaturated EtOH. This one i have to wash and then also step by step to 75% normal EtOH?
>
>
> Sincerely,
> Joosep Sarapuu
>
>
>
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NHCOLL-L is brought to you by the Society for the Preservation of
Natural History Collections (SPNHC), an international society whose
mission is to improve the preservation, conservation and management of
natural history collections to ensure their continuing value to
society. See http://www.spnhc.org for membership information.
Advertising on NH-COLL-L is inappropriate.

YMWADIAD
Rydym yn croesawu gohebiaeth yn Gymraeg a Saesneg, ac yn sicrhau y byddwn yn cyfathrebu â chi yn eich iaith ddewisol, boed yn Gymraeg, Saesneg neu’r ddwy, dim ond i chi ein hysbysu. Ni fydd gohebu yn Gymraeg yn peri oedi.

Mae pob neges e-bost a anfonir at neu gan Amgueddfa Cymru yn cael ei
sganio gan systemau diogelwch awtomatig. Sganiwyd y neges hon am firysau cyn ei hanfon, ond dylech hefyd wirio bod y neges, a phob atodiad ynddi, yn rhydd o firysau cyn ei defnyddio. Nid ydym yn derbyn cyfrifoldeb am unrhyw golled neu ddifrod o ganlyniad i agor y neges neu unrhyw atodiadau. Gall y neges hon ac unrhyw ffeiliau a atodir ynddi gynnwys gwybodaeth gyfrinachol a fwriadwyd ar gyfer y derbynnydd yn unig. Os ydych chi wedi derbyn y neges trwy gamgymeriad, hysbyswch ni a dileu’r neges. Safbwyntiau personol yr awdur a fynegir yn y neges hon, ac nid ydynt o reidrwydd yn cynrychioli safbwyntiau Amgueddfa Cymru. Nid ydym yn derbyn cyfrifoldeb am unrhyw wallau, llygredd neu esgeulustod a allai godi wrth drosglwyddo'r neges hon.

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We welcome correspondence in Welsh and English, and we will ensure that we communicate with you in the language of your choice, whether that’s English, Welsh or both if you let us know which you prefer. Corresponding in Welsh will not lead to any delay.

E-mail to and from Amgueddfa Cymru is scanned by automated security systems. This message was scanned for viruses before transmission, but you should also satisfy yourself that the message, and all attachments, are virus-free before use. We can accept no responsibility for any loss or damage that might arise from opening the message or any attachments. This message and any files transmitted with it may contain confidential information intended only for the recipient. If you receive the message by mistake please inform us and delete it. The views expressed in this message are the personal views of the author and may not necessarily represent those of Amgueddfa Cymru. We accept no liability for any errors, corruption or omissions that might arise in transmission of this message.

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