The other "other" side

David Smith idleweed at
Thu Aug 3 07:57:39 EDT 2000

Hello all,
     I am tired of listening to "can we have a reference for that". Mr.
Cherubini makes all kinds of attacks upon scientists that he does not agree
with and offers no references. Also he states that the chemical industry has
changed its ways and is now a loving, wonderful group of people (sarcasm).
When Mr. Shuey makes a statement about farmers being worried about anything
(drought, birds, etc.) he does not need a reference, he is the reference. If
everyone is going to need a reference for everything they say there message
will be three lines and the references will be the next twenty. I am not on
either side of this issue as I really don't know enough about it. I am just
tired of "where's your reference" and I am sorry but I have no reference for
any of the above.
        David Smith
----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Cherubini <cherubini at>
To: <leps-l at>
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 5:28 AM
Subject: Re: The other "other" side

> John Shuey wrote:
> >
> > One thing to note about Bt corn.  Many farmers in the Midwest are
> > that because corn apparently has a tendency to cross with Johnson grass
> > (strong evidence of genetic exchange has been established between these
> > species), that Bt genes will become the norm in this major economically
> > negative weed.  Farmers aren't happy about the prospect of an insect
> > resistant ag weed developing in the Midwest.
> Bt corn crossing with johnsongrass? Wow, this is news. Do you
> have a reference, John?
> I have heard of cultivated grain sorghum (Sorghum bicolor) hybridizing
> under field condition with johnsongrass (Sorghum halepense)
> but not corn and johnsongrass.
> In any case, the only insect that Bt corn provides good control of
> is the European Corn Borer Moth. Other moth pests of corn are not
> well controlled. Even if they were and a Bt johnsongrass was
> accidentally created, what would be the consequences?. I have never
> heard of a case where the feeding damage of a lep caterpillar was
> extensive enough to impact the abundance of a widespread
> exotic, invasive crop weed like johnsongrass.
> Have you heard of such a phenomenon?
> Paul Cherubini

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