[leps-talk] Ron Proves Creationism wrong

[David Smith]

Hello,
    First I have to apologise for this post as it should be on a philosophy
list-serve. Second let me state that I believe in God. Thirdly, I also
believe the theory of evolution is correct.
    Now to my main problem with creationists as it pertains to lepidoptera
and systematics. If a person believes lepidoptera were created spontaneously
why in the world would they be studying systematics or thier relationships
to one another or even to the rest of zoology? A fritllary is created from
this dust mote while an otter is created from a dust mote right next to it
and a swallowtail is created from a dust mote on the other side of the
world. What is related to what here? If they are just created how do you
know they are related, merely because they look alike? If God created them
out of thin air there is no systematics that I could ever understand.
Believe what you like but quit preaching to me. Thanks
                David Smith

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Walker" <MWalker at gensym.com>
To: <TILS-leps-talk at yahoogroups.com>; "leps-l" <leps-l at lists.yale.edu>
Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 11:15 AM
Subject: RE: [leps-talk] Ron Proves Creationism wrong


> Charles Bordelon writes:
>
> > ...  Everything is or has been
> > created.  Evolution, I also firmly believe in...
>
> and
>
>
> > Now, I don't know about you guys, but that's [Christ] a tough act to
> follow...  I'm
> > painting myself into a corner, here.  RON, HELP!!!
>
> Charles isn't in a corner at all.  He's out in the open - and free of the
> shackles that most others have burdened themselves with (by choice, I
might
> add).
>
> How silly it is for anyone to attempt to argue scientifically in favor of
a
> Godless universe.  We know absolutely nothing that can explain how such an
> incredible event could possibly occur by accident (except, of course, that
> the event is so highly improbable that our math doesn't even have a way to
> quantify it).  We can speak of variation and mutation, but none of this
> begins to explain how matter or energy could come to exist in the first
> place.  Our theories are mere tinker-toys when it comes to explaining the
> origin of life and the universe.
>
> I've found that people who attempt to provide scientific "evidence" of a
> Godless universe have come to NEED to have an explanation that disproves
> God, and this bias is obvious from their arguments.  These are the people
> who have backed themselves into a corner - not Charles.
>
> It is not silly (or unscientific) to ponder the question of how our
universe
> came to be.  Wondering about (and questioning the possible existence of)
God
> is, in fact, at the heart of science, and anyone who would shy away from
> such metaphysical questions should be the one accused of not being
> scientific - not the other way around.
>
> Personally, I see overwhelming evidence of Creation wherever I go - in the
> mountains, in the waterfalls, in the plants and animals - but especially
in
> the hearts and faces of human children.  God is real and very much alive
in
> the world that I live in.
>
> I have a Bachelors of Science in Electronic Engineering, including a minor
> in Physics, a Masters of Science in Computer Engineering, and a hard
earned
> PhD in living life - and I've found nothing in all the wisdom of man that
> can counter or disprove the existence of God.  Of course, I have the
benefit
> of having received the gift of the knowledge of God - something that He
> readily offers every living human being, incidentally - so I suppose I
> shouldn't expect anyone to take my word for anything.  Such discernment
and
> understanding comes only from the Spirit of God, though clues for its
> discovery have been scattered about the world and throughout the heavens
so
> that all might possess it - bushman and businessman alike.
>
> Sorry if this sounds arrogant - it is in fact quite the opposite of
> arrogance.  You see, this sort of understanding comes by way of humility -
> and not pride.  Any creature standing on the surface of this planet and
> beholding this incredible universe that isn't overcome by an overwhelming
> humility is truly the fool.
>
> But it is for such fools, after all, that Christ died...
>
> Shalom,
>
> Mark Walker
>
>
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