Corporate denial on climate change

Wed Sep 20 18:56:19 EDT 2006

Michael,

Very interesting. Like you said, we live on a dynamic earth. Sometimes its colder, sometimes warmer, depending of the sun cycle, volcanos and others variation in our solar system. I agree with you when you say that this hapened since the begining of the earth and "when we were not here".

Perhaps, I disagree with you on when you say that we have noly a minimal impact. We are responsible for the climate change thet happend right now. My english is not very good but I'll try to explain you (an other) my idea.

Never the temperature and the CO2 quantity has increased at a such  hight rate. The current climate change is too fast and plants and animals can't adapt to this. You can't see this on your graphic beacause the scale is too great.

The climate is dynamic but the different systems that affect the climate are in balance. The problem is that the quantity of CO2 we released in the atmosphere are so high that the other system can compensate (example : forest, alguea ocean). As the CO2 quantity increase, the temperature increase. As the temperature increase, the pergelisol melt and an enormous quantity of CO2 is released. so the temperature increase more. Also, the oceans hide an enormous quantity of CO2 as ice and an increase of the temperature will release this CO2 into the atmosphere and so on... Finally, we can say that we are responsible to have initiated a wheel that will result in a too fast and too high climate change. But dont worry, this should not "kill" the earth... because it will result in a next glaciation period.

Also, if the average temperature on earth increase, many place would become colder. This is due to changes in oceans density, marin currents etc... This is why the experts decided to call the phenomenon "Climate change". They dont change the name because they dont want to be wrong or silly or whatever !!!!

You said we have no idea ??? We can only guess ?? No, we have ideas and data... And we can make model and scenarios.... 

You said "A few degrees temperature increase would be good for most places on earth." You dont know what your are saying... What mean a few degres for you ? I hope it is not more than 2 °C !!!

I hope you understand... 

Finally, stoping to burn petrol will not stop the process... it will not even stabilize the acceleration rate...

Don't worry, butterflies and moths will always be there !
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Michael E. Soukup 
  To: hkmoths at yahoo.co.uk 
  Cc: Leps-l ; hkmoths at yahoogroups.com ; ukmoths at yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 6:48 AM
  Subject: Re: Corporate denial on climate change

  Sorry Roger,

    I don't share your view on this.  
    "Climate Change" on earth has been going on for 6 billion years - of which man has been present for a only a tiny, tiny fraction.  I have no doubt that "climate change" is going on presently (notice how they no longer call it "global warming" - this is due to the fact that calling it "global warming" could  make one look like a fool in a few years - if there is a cooling trend.  Calling it "climate change" - well, you can't go wrong with that!!  I mean, if it gets warmer, colder, wetter, drier, calmer, stormier - it doesn't matter - you can blame ALL of it on "climate change" - it covers all of the bases.  It's disingenuous - but it's covers one's butt.  I even told my wife 10 years ago, when "global warming" was all rage that soon they would change that name to "Global climate change" - because global warming "could be wrong".  And, since the experts truly had and have no clue as to whether the earth is getting warmer or cooler (it's getting warmer in some places, cooler in others), they would have to change the name of their mission to "global climate change" in order to not look silly.

    So, yes, I believe "climate change" is going on.  No, I don't believe man has anything but a minimal impact on it.  Nor do I believe we can do anything about it. 

  Here is a chart from wikipedia showing temperatures over the past 400,000 years from the Vostok Ice cores.  You will note that the graph is never a flat line.  We live on a dynamic earth.  We can't change that - nor should we actually try until we understand everything about the entire universal system - ie. we are Gods.  And, that isn't happening any time soon.  All we can do is adapt.

  In addition, there is much more earth that is not inhabitable because it is too cold than because it is too warm.  A few degrees temperature increase would be good for most places on earth.  Sure they would change.  Some animals and plants might go extinct.  Others may come into being.  We have no idea.  We can only guess.

  So, why should Exxon spend billions and trillions of dollars - all of which, in the end, comes out of the pockets of the poorest peoples - and is immediately funnelled into the hands of people who want to control everything that goes on on the planet - on a "percieved problem" - that we probably can't do anything about??

  I will leave with one more small picture - one of my favorites.  It shows the relative size of the planets and the sun.  After viewing it, which do you think would be the simplest (ie. occams razor) explanation for climate change....man-made activities - or that huge golden orbl 4 light minutes away.....

  Just my 2 cents.....

  Roger C. KENDRICK wrote: 
    forgot to paste in the details!

    The denial industry
    The oil giant ExxonMobil gives money to scores of organisations that claim
    the science on global warming is inconclusive - which it isn't. It's a
    strategy that has set back action on climate change by a decade, and it
    involves the same people who insist that passive smoking is harmless,
    reveals George Monbiot in the first of three extracts from his new book
    George Monbiot
    Tuesday September 19 2006
    The Guardian (U.K. newspaper)

    http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1876540,00.html
    http://environment.guardian.co.uk/climatechange/story/0,,1875762,00.html

    "Roger C. KENDRICK" <hkmoths at yahoo.co.uk> wrote: 
      F.Y.I.
      some incisive news on ExxonMobil & their cronies

      cheers,

      Roger

    Roger C. KENDRICK Ph.D.
    Senior Conservation Officer, Fauna Conservation, 
    Kadoorie Farm & Botanic Garden, Hong Kong
    http://www.kfbg.org/ 

    Hong Kong Moths - http://asia.geocities.com/hkmoths/
    discussion group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Hkmoths/

    C & R Wildlife (sole proprietor), Tai Po, Hong Kong 
    hkmoths at yahoo.co.uk 

-- 
Mike Soukup
The Nature Depot
P.O. Box 393
Gambrills, MD  21054
(410) 729-1912
http://www.thenaturedepot.com
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