[yul-naco] YUL NACO list question

[Bourassa, Dominique]

Hi Wheat and Tom,

Tom mentioned: “I cannot find any 372 documentation that addresses this specific situation, but the documentation for the 374 clearly says not to qualify by nationality (among other things), which might serve as a model.” Indeed, the LC-PCC PS for 9.16.1.3 states:
Use terms for profession or occupation without indication of the person’s gender, nationality, religion, etc., unless such characteristics are part of the definition of the term itself (e.g., a Rabbi is a Jewish religious leader).  Prefer gender-neutral terms to gender-specific terms when possible (e.g., Actor instead of Actress and Fire fighter instead of Fireman). Information not included as part of the profession or occupation term may be appropriate for other elements, such as Other designation associated with the person, see 9.6.1.9. (…) When the term for the profession or occupation includes words that are part of the profession or occupation rather than an indication of the person’s gender, nationality, etc., these may be recorded” (ex. Midwives).

The way I see it is that if PCC wanted to forbid us to record nationality in 372, there would be an LC-PCC PS with such instruction. Since there’s no instruction, I interpret this as meaning that we can record such terms. It’s all about cataloger’s judgment! But I am certain there are people who disagree with me. And that’s perfectly fine.

Like Wheat and Tom showed “German poetry” can mean different things to different people. People can even disagree with what the term “field of activity” means (“a field of endeavour, area of expertise, etc., in which a person is engaged or was engaged”). This is why we find NACO records in which people recorded in 372 German poetry while others preferred to record Poetry.

Personally, I rarely, if ever record field of activity such as, 372 $a Poetry, and I don’t think I ever recorded something like 372 $a German poetry $2 lcsh. I prefer to record simply 374 $a Poets and 377 $a ger. This is the fun part about doing NACO work. We all develop our own style.

Please, don’t be shy to weigh in.
Dominique

From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu> on behalf of Meier, Tachtorn <tachtorn.meier at yale.edu>
Date: Thursday, October 5, 2023 at 1:30 PM
To: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>
Subject: Re: [yul-naco] YUL NACO list question
Dear Colleagues,

I apologize for sending an email prematurely.

Please feel free to share your thoughts on this NACO question.

“The question has arisen of whether/when in the 372 it is appropriate to use a term qualified by nationality.  For example, if one is creating a NAR for a poet living in Germany and writing in German, could the 372 be “German poetry” (an established LCSH), or should it simply be “Poetry”?  My feeling is that it should just be “Poetry,” unless the individual very explicitly writes poetry about ONLY Germany and German issues.  (Of course, for an NAR for a scholar studying/writing about German poetry, a 372 “German poetry” would be totally appropriate.)  I cannot find any 372 documentation that addresses this specific situation, but the documentation for the 374 clearly says not to qualify by nationality (among other things), which might serve as a model.  And as a real-world example, the NAR for Walt Whitman 1819-1892, which has been updated multiple times by LC and is currently RDA-compliant, simply has a 372 for “Poetry.”

Best,
Wheat



From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu> On Behalf Of Meier, Tachtorn
Sent: Thursday, October 5, 2023 11:09 AM
To: Bolze, Thomas <thomas.bolze at yale.edu>
Cc: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>
Subject: Re: [yul-naco] YUL NACO list question

Hi Tom,

Definitely!

I did a quick search in the OCLC, and I found records with the terms qualified by nationality, such as German poetry, children's poetry, German poetry, Spanish poetry, etc. in the 372. For me, German poetry could be interpreted as a poem written in German or a poem written by the Germans or German people. But then, there is "Argentine poetry." Argentine isn’t a language but rather a nationality. As a non-native English speaker, I often get confused about the usage.

Would you like to post this on YUL-NACO<mailto:Distribution%20list%20for%20YUL%20NACO%20catalogers%20%3cyul-naco at mailman.yale.edu%3e> list or would you like to post this on your behalf. I can make it anonymous if you prefer.

Best,
Wheat

From: Bolze, Thomas <thomas.bolze at yale.edu<mailto:thomas.bolze at yale.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, October 4, 2023 1:42 PM
To: Meier, Tachtorn <tachtorn.meier at yale.edu<mailto:tachtorn.meier at yale.edu>>
Subject: YUL NACO list question

Wheat,

In addition to that issue we discussed re. the LC-created NAR that Chuck needs to update, which is still in process, I hit another situation that Jeanette suggested might be appropriate for the NACO list.

The question has arisen of whether/when in the 372 it is appropriate to use a term qualified by nationality.  For example, if one is creating a NAR for a poet living in Germany and writing in German, could the 372 be “German poetry” (an established LCSH), or should it simply be “Poetry”?  My feeling is that it should just be “Poetry,” unless the individual very explicitly writes poetry about ONLY Germany and German issues.  (Of course, for an NAR for a scholar studying/writing about German poetry, a 372 “German poetry” would be totally appropriate.)  I cannot find any 372 documentation that addresses this specific situation, but the documentation for the 374 clearly says not to qualify by nationality (among other things), which might serve as a model.  And as a real-world example, the NAR for Walt Whitman 1819-1892, which has been updated multiple times by LC and is currently RDA-compliant, simply has a 372 for “Poetry.”

But, is this something that might benefit from NACO list discussion?

Tom
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