[yul-naco] AAP for French name

Wed Jun 4 10:31:39 EDT 2025

Hi Hannelore,

Thank you for confirming the original of De Baer. Your comment about Belgium being a difficult case is true. I think it can also apply to other countries like Switzerland that have more than one official language. It is also true because people are moving across borders. It's not always easy to know how to treat a compound name or a name with a prefix because we do not always know the origin of a person's name or where a person was born. There are so many variables.

Unfortunately, it seems RDA wants us to write de and van. The basic instruction for names of agents and places (A.2.1) states:
"In general, capitalize the first word of each name. Capitalize other words by applying the guidelines at A.10[cid:image002.png at 01DBD53A.AE891340]<https://original.rdatoolkit.org/document.php?id=rdaappa&target=rdaa-369#rdaa-369>-A.55[cid:image002.png at 01DBD53A.AE891340]<https://original.rdatoolkit.org/document.php?id=rdaappa&target=rdaa-2383#rdaa-2383>, as applicable to the language involved.
For names with unusual capitalization, follow the capitalization of the commonly known form."
Following this instruction brings us to RDA A.38.2 for Dutch name that instructs us to "Capitalize the prefixes de, ten, van, if not preceded by the Christian name."

Since in the access point De Baer is preceded by a Christian name, Marcel, we cannot capitalize the prefix at the end of the access point. Sorry about that.

Dominique

From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu> On Behalf Of Segers, Hannelore
Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2025 9:46 AM
To: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>
Subject: Re: [yul-naco] AAP for French name

Hi Wheat,

After doing a little bit more digging, De Baer is definitely a last name of Dutch (Germanic etymologically) origin. Belgium can be a bit of a difficult case since some people living in the Flemish part of the country can have last names of French origin (and the reverse can also be true of course).

Just a quick note, though, about the capitalization of De. The rule in Flemish is that we capitalize the "De" and "Van" prefixes in names (except in some very rare exceptions-one of them is in the case of nobility). Dutch generally does not capitalize these prefixes. Unless RDA does not allow it, I would personally keep the "De" capitalized to reflect Flemish use.

Best,
Hannelore

Hannelore Segers, PhD

Early Materials Cataloger

Beinecke Rare Book and Manuscript Library, Yale Library

hannelore.segers at yale.edu<mailto:hannelore.segers at yale.edu>

she/her

________________________________
From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> on behalf of Meier, Tachtorn <tachtorn.meier at yale.edu<mailto:tachtorn.meier at yale.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2025 9:32 AM
To: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>>
Subject: Re: [yul-naco] AAP for French name

Hi Mara,

Thank you for your clear explanation about French articles and prepositions-now it all makes sense!
I also want to thank Hannelore for pointing out that the name "Marcel De Baer" might be connected to the Flanders region of Belgium, where Flemish/Dutch is spoken. I have confirmed from the book that Marcel De Baer is indeed from Belgium!
So now we know how to construct AAP for this person!
Best,
Wheat

________________________________
From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> on behalf of Caelin, Mara <mara.caelin at yale.edu<mailto:mara.caelin at yale.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2025 8:54 AM
To: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>>
Subject: Re: [yul-naco] AAP for French name

Hi Wheat,

In French, "Du" and "Des" and are contractions of the article plus the preposition (de + le/ de + les), meaning "of the". "De" by itself is only a preposition ("of"), which would put it in the second category mentioned in the example.

Following the example, it looks like the AAP should be "Baer, Marcel de".

Hope that is helpful!

Best,
Mara

Mara Caelin (she/her/hers)
Catalog/Metadata Librarian
Bibliographic Description Unit
Beinecke Rare Book and Manuscript Library
Yale University

________________________________
From: YUL-NACO <yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco-bounces at mailman.yale.edu>> on behalf of Meier, Tachtorn <tachtorn.meier at yale.edu<mailto:tachtorn.meier at yale.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2025 8:09 AM
To: Distribution list for YUL NACO catalogers <yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu<mailto:yul-naco at mailman.yale.edu>>
Subject: [yul-naco] AAP for French name

Hi!

I am helping my colleague in constructing an AAP for an individual named "Marcel De Baer." We consulted RDA instruction F.11.5 (see below), but we found the example a bit confusing. Since neither of us is fluent in French, we are hoping someone can explain the differences presented in the instruction and clarify which form should be applied to this name.
For verification, the prefix "De" appears with a capital "D" on the sources we have.
Thank you!
Wheat

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