Feedback from the Monarch authorities regarding research project

[Paul Cherubini]

Jim Wiggins wrote:

> We would like to open the proposed study to discussion.  A comparison of
> tagged indigenous (Monarch Watch) vs transplanted Monarchs (Educational
> Science) over time might provide some interesting data. 
> 
> Subj:   Permit to conduct scientific study of transplanted Western and
> Eastern Monarchs

Jim, here is some additional information and opinions from various monarch experts 
gathered from the July 1999 archives of the dplex-l and the Sept 1995 and Sept. 1996 issues 
of Bioscience magazine:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Karen.S.Oberhauser-1 at tc.umn.edu
Subject: Re: where are the scientists
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1999 16:40:11 +0000

Regarding the following comment:

>I've noted several emails asking what the feeling of scientists is
>concerning the need for more research on migration of eastern vs. western
>monarchs. Do they get "mixed up" if they migrate from an area distant from
>their natal origin? I haven't seen a single response from a monarch
>scientist. Why is that? Is this not a valid scientific question which
>obviously needs to be answered? Everyone is quick to say these butterflies
>get mixed up, but no one seems willing to propose studies to actually prove
>this hypothesis. As a scientist I find it an interesting question and am
>appalled at the one-sidedness of this argument.

Nina,

As a scientist, I would love to know the answer to the question of whether
there are genetic differencs between the eastern and western monarch
populations in responses to migratory cues. However, I can only think of one
way, using our current understanding of monarch migration, to get a
definitive answer to this question - releasing large numbers of monarchs
from different natal origins in places other than those in which they would
find themselves naturally. At this point, we don't know enough about the
natural cues used by monarchs to duplicate them in the lab, so the releases
would need to be in "the wild". Large numbers of butterflies would be needed
because the recovery rate is very low.

Clearly, the most interesting comparison would be between monarchs from the eastern and 
western populations. However, the potential problems with such a release have been pointed 
out often, and are well-summarized in a BioScience ARticle by Brower et al  (1995, 
45:540-544; see also further discussion of this point in the September 1996 issue of 
BioScience); these problems include risk of transfering diseases which occur in different 
frequencies in different populaitons, and the chance that such transfers could make it 
difficult or impossible to study many aspects of basic monarch genetics and population 
structure.

It is, of course, possible that large-scale studies would not impact monarch
populations in irreversible or harmful ways. However, as a scientist and as
a citizen committed to doing everything I can to preserving the phenomenon
of monarch migration, I am unwilling to take the risk or to condone such
studies.

Karen Oberhauser Department of Ecology, Evolution and Behavior University
of Minnesota 1987 Upper Buford Circle St. Paul MN 55108 612 624-8706, fax
612 624-6777
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: monarch at UKANS.EDU
Subject: Re: E vs W migration : tagging vs isotopes
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 15:23:36 -0500

> In lieu of these data, what IS the basis for stating that there are
> differences in eastern and western monarch genetics? Is it an assumption
> or is it a scientifically proven fact? 

Dr. Nina Elshiekh Institute for Biotechnology InformationResearch Triangle Park, North 
Carolina

`Nina: Given this statement in our emails that crossed in cyberspace:

The amount of gene flow between E-W is probably very low. If it is
substantially less than 1% per generation, and given the size of the monarch populations in 
the contact areas of the Rockies relative to the total populations E and W, it is probably much 
lower than this, it is certainly possible that the populations are genetically distinct.

You are correct. We are presuming these populations are distinct based the
low probability of gene flow per generation of 1% or more. But, stay tuned
additional studies are in progress..

O.R. Taylor, Dept. of
Entomology, 7005 Haworth Hall, Univ. of KS, Lawrence KS 6604
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Brower et al 1995 Bioscience 45:540-544:

"The multiplicity of known and likely differences [between eastern and western monarchs] 
imply that suites of adaptations under genetic control could differ substantially in the two 
populations. It is conceivable that transfers could result in considerable genetic 
disequilibrium and force massive selective reorganization and genetic deaths in both 
populations".
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Brower et al 1996 Bioscience 46: 563:

"Keiper maintains that natural selection would assure that recipient monarch populations 
would rapidly evolve resistance to introduced foreign strains of pathogens or protozoan 
parasites such as Ophryocystis elektroscirra.

Keiper's argument ignores the fact that most parasites and pathogens are coevolving entities 
with generation times as short or shorter than their hosts. Consequently, a much longer time 
would likely be needed for the monarchs to evolve resistance, during which time recurrent 
epidemics could lower the monarchs' overwintering population sizes to the point which 
interactions with known or unknown ecological factors might become devastating."

"Keipers argument that natural selection would rapidly eliminate deleterious alleles in 
recipient populations is correct, but it ignores the fact that selectively nuetral alleles would 
also be introduced by the transfers and corrupt the very data geneticists use to estimate the 
magnitude of past gene flow that occurred naturally between populations."