Brower replies- The most recent ranting about monarch butterfly conservation

Thu Oct 9 19:55:21 EDT 2003

And likewise, I  was waiting for you to give this kind of response so 
that I can say: You are missing the point! Your definition of a 
successful species, exemplified by your examples, is one that has 
already _passed_ the test, whatever it may be. The passenger pigeon did 
not pass its test and so it is extinct. You cannot say the Monarch will 
be a successful species with regard to the Mexico migration until it has 
passed its test, which in this case will be adapting to the human 
destruction of the habitat it is now using or may use in lieu of its 
current overwintering habitat. This may take many years to be realized.
Stan

Charles Bordelon wrote:

>That's exactly the reply I was praying to hear...  Where's my shotgun, ma?
>I'm gonna go shoot me some Monarchs...  Get a life, people.  cb
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Stanley A. Gorodenski" <stan_gorodenski at asualumni.org>
>Cc: <leps-l at lists.yale.edu>
>Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 5:25 PM
>Subject: Re: Brower replies- The most recent ranting about monarch butterfly
>conservation
>
>
>  
>
>>You forgot the passenger pigeon.
>>
>>Charles Bordelon wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Are we to assume Monarchs are too stupid to find other sites?  All this
>>>      
>>>
>talk
>  
>
>>>and number-crunching is dung in the real world. What did house sparrows
>>>      
>>>
>do
>  
>
>>>before there were houses?  Barn swallows before barns?  Ratings, ratings,
>>>rantings...  So what?  You can't tell me such a successful insect
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>>>
>couldn't
>  
>
>>>adapt.  We'll destroy ourselves before every resource is depleted.  Go to
>>>the Mexican Government.  This whole Monarch business is not only moot,
>>>      
>>>
>it's
>  
>
>>>completely boring.  cb
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: <neil at nwjones.demon.co.uk>
>>>To: <tils-leps-talk at yahoogroups.com>
>>>Cc: <leps-l at lists.yale.edu>; <brower at sbc.edu>
>>>Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 1:49 PM
>>>Subject: Brower replies- The most recent ranting about monarch butterfly
>>>conservation
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Professor Brower asked me to pass on this message to these lists.
>>>>
>>>>Neil Jones
>>>>
>>>>From: Lincoln P. Brower brower at sbc.edu
>>>>Subject: The most recent ranting about monarch butterfly conservation
>>>>by Mr. Cherubini.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>To whom it may concern:
>>>>
>>>>To those who may seriously consider taking Mr. Paul Cherubini's
>>>>October 2003 criticisms of L. P. Brower's recent (4 October 2003)
>>>>lecture to the Pacific Grove Museum of Natural History in California,
>>>>I suggest perusing the following three scientific papers:
>>>>
>>>>1) Brower, L.P., Kust, D.R., Rendon-Salinas, E., Serrano, E.G.,
>>>>Kust, K.R., Miller, J., Fernandez del Rey, C., &amp; Pape, K. (In
>>>>press  2003). Catastrophic winter storm mortality of monarch
>>>>butterflies in Mexico during January 2002. In: The Monarch Butterfly:
>>>>Biology and Conservation (Editors. K.M. Oberhauser  M.
>>>>Solensky). Cornell University Press, Ithaca.
>>>>
>>>>2) Brower, L.P., Castilleja, G., Peralta, A., Lopez-Garcia, J.,
>>>>Bojorquez-Tapia, L., Diaz, S., Melgarejo, D.,  Missrie, M.
>>>>(2002). Quantitative changes in forest quality in a principal
>>>>overwintering area of the monarch butterfly in Mexico: 1971 to
>>>>1999. Conservation Biology, 16, 346-359.
>>>>
>>>>3) Bojorquez, L.A., Brower, L.P., Castilleja, G.,
>>>>Sánchez-Colón, S., Hernández, M., Calvert, W.H., Díaz, S.,
>>>>Gómez-Priego, P., Alcantar, G., Melgarejo, E.D., Solares, M.J.,
>>>>Gutiérrez, L., Juárez, M.d.L. (2003). Mapping expert
>>>>knowledge: redesigning the monarch butterfly biosphere reserve.
>>>>Conservation Biology, 17, 367 - 379.
>>>>
>>>>The first paper (still in press) documents the winter storm mortality
>>>>of overwintering monarch butterflies in Mexico that occurred in
>>>>January 2002. One quarter of a billion monarchs were estimated
>>>>to have been killed in two of several known colonies, all of which
>>>>were impacted by a powerful and widespread storm and cold
>>>>front. The second publication documents that the monarchs'
>>>>overwintering forest within the 1986 presidentially decreed reserve
>>>>has been degraded by 44% as well as heavily fragmented over a 28 year
>>>>period, through January 1999. The third publication describes the
>>>>process and rationale by which the new 2000 presidential decree
>>>>increased the supposedly protected overwintering area from 62 to 217
>>>>square miles. Research in progress with colleagues from the
>>>>University of Mexico, NASA, Lynchburg College and Sweet Briar College
>>>>indicates that extensive illegal logging is currently occurring
>>>>within the supposedly protected areas. When these data are published,
>>>>they will be available for public scrutiny.
>>>>
>>>>The exact number of years it will take for the current and increasing
>>>>logging to irreversibly disrupt the migration of the monarch's
>>>>eastern population is always an unknown. What we do know is
>>>>that the forests within the tiny area of Mexico in which hundreds of
>>>>millions of monarchs overwinter is being rapidly degraded.
>>>>Denial of this is yet another example of the ostrich-like behavior of
>>>>the more extreme members of the anti-conservation movement who choose
>>>>to obfuscate hard scientific evidence in order to advance their
>>>>political positions.
>>>>
>>>>Lincoln P. Brower
>>>>Research Professor of Biology
>>>>Sweet Briar College
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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