FW: US standardized name reference

Grkovich, Alex agrkovich at tmpeng.com
Thu Jul 5 08:34:39 EDT 2001



> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Grkovich, Alex 
> Sent:	Thursday, July 05, 2001 8:32 AM
> To:	'viceroy at gate.net'
> Subject:	RE: US standardized name reference
> 
> As far as "Common Names" are concerned, recently we heard about the
> "decree" from New York City to refer to all subspecies and hybrids within
> the Limenitis arthemis species complex as "Red Spotted Admirals". And here
> in New England, a couple of individuals have already started to report
> sightings of, presumably, Red Spotted Purples and perhaps hybrids with
> partial white bands, as "Red Spotted Admirals". Not only is this
> taxonomically quite incorrect (and unprecedented), but imagine the
> worthless data that will be available to a potential researcher in the
> future, who may be aspiring to determine the ranges and/or occurrences of
> the various taxa in, say, southern New England (where subsp. arthemis and
> astyannax as well as many hybrids are found). How will a meaningful
> scientific paper  ever be written, when all the researcher will find is
> recordings of "Red Spotted Admirals"? And I invite someone who is involved
> in these shenanigans to explain to me in rational terms how he or she will
> justify calling the Arizona Red Spotted Purple a "Red Spotted Admiral"?
> Where on earth is the study of Lepidoptera going? I guess the science of
> Lepidoptera study is no longer significant? 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Anne Kilmer [SMTP:viceroy at anu.ie]
> Sent:	Thursday, July 05, 2001 2:06 AM
> To:	Ron Gatrelle
> Cc:	Dameron, Wanda; Leps-l
> Subject:	Re: US standardized name reference
> 
> Ron Gatrelle wrote:
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dameron, Wanda" <be496 at lafn.org>
> > Subject: Re: US standardized name reference
> > > Dear Ron,
> > > Am assuming LBJ is use of the common acronym of "little brown job;"
> sss
> > > is likely Silver-spotted Skipper found throughout the east;  next time
> > > to make name conversions either way, suggest simplyfying your efforts
> by
> > > using your keyboard 'control' and 'find' keys simultaneously on the
> > > Standardized name list at: http://www.naba.org/pubs/enames.html
> > >
> > 
> 
> Thank you, Wanda, that's a great resource. 
> 
> 
> > Dear Wanda,
> >      Your reply is typical and proves my point. I said this is not about
> > common or correct names.  It is about _people_ who live on a one way
> > street - the one with their name on it.   It is about throngs who
> _refuse_
> > to use correct names but at the same time  _insist_ that all others use
> > common names. And now, more and more, they are just using letters that
> they
> > expect everyone else to know.
> >     Even you don't _know_ what LBJ stood for, you just "assume". And you
> > are quite willing to just assume in order to protect and promote your
> > sacred cow. This is real good science, real good documentation of, and
> > relaying of, observed taxa to the world community.
> 
> much vitriol snipped
> 
> >     Sorry Wanda,  there is nothing standardized about "your" names. You
> > can't even keep them a year without changing them. There was nothing
> wrong
> > with (1833) Ogeechee Brown Hairstreak as a common name - somebody just
> > didn't like it. Which was their prerogative, and mine - I have chosen to
> > keep using it. That is what common names are all about - what ever us
> > common people want to call something.
> > 
> >     Every single known organism on the planet already has a correct name
> -
> > these are highly regulated under international rules called the ICZN,
> ICBN
> > etc. - a real - standardized system that has been in place for
> centuries.
> > 
> > RG
> > 
> Ron, Wanda is a nice lady who was trying to help you. Can't you lighten
> up? It's about butterflies. 
> As for your notion that the "correct name" for an organism is the one
> that the scientists give it, nonsense! Children and poets name things,
> and if we don't like the scientists' names, they will fade away like
> morning dew. 
> Just go on using both sets of names, setting a good example to the
> others, and ignore the whiners. That's a nice web page, although I think
> Occuring needs another r in there. Right up top, too. Proof readers tend
> to miss headline typos.
> 
> Me, I'm looking at a garden full of chickadees, and trying to remember
> what I'm supposed to call them in Ireland. Coal tit, I think. They are
> blithely unaware of any label I may care to attach to them, and so will
> your butterflies be, as long as you haven't pinned them down. 
> Blessed be all of you, scholars and saints, on this fine morning, and
> may your bile flow sweetly into its proper channels, attend to your
> digestion, and quit clogging this list. 
> Anne Kilmer
> Mayo, Ireland
> 
>  
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